you call the shot - #2

[Twanger]

This buck walked under your stand in the early morning light and bedded down cross-wind about 20 yards away. He is clearly unalerted. Do you shoot him where he lays? If so, where? If not, would you try to get him up before the shot by making a noise?

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/deer_bedded_broadside_dots.JPG

[dave-t.]

Center green looks good to me. I wouldn't wait for the shot at all if there was a clear lane.

[DaveHawk]

Short gunt call and wait for him to stand. LOL

[GF.]

Sort of, anyway - I had a buck bedded within sight of my stand last fall, but he was directly behind a couple of 4" maples, so I had to wait for him to stand up...

Well, first off, this is a bigger buck than any that I've ever seen through sights, so that might cloud my judgement in real life. This is much lower pressure, so it's easier to think it through....

Yellow is out of the question, IMO; I've tracked a neck wound way too far once already, so as I say - out of the question. So are red & blue. Too far back.

Green is on the edge - back edge of the shoulder blade, that is....Probably looking at 1 lung and some liver on that angle.... The lowest one, though, is the right hold for my #1 pin, because I would hit high at that range, especially from a 15' or 20' stand. Probably the best spot to hold on here would put you right into the big knuckle where shoulder blade meets upper leg bone, and that's not much of a shot for a bow...

I wouldn't make any effort to get him up, though - too great a chance of having him blow out of there entirely.

So where does that leave me...:confused:

Well, unless I was getting so cold so fast that I figured that I wouldn't be able to draw in another hour or so, I think I'd take a page from Herne's book on this one and wait for him to get up all on his own. He'll stand up; he'll take a whiz; he'll look around a bit, and then he'll amble off. That should give you about 30 seconds to get to full draw and pick your spot before you have to rethink your range estimate.

And if he gets out of there without offering a good shot... well, that's hunting, isn't it?

[Smokey]

A low grunt call should make him stand up. I'd wait till he stood up.

[Twanger]

Ok... so here's where McKenzie says the vitals are...
If I'm reading this right, it puts the KZ right below the middle blue dot.
We have this target/shot on our 3D range, and I'd take it right away.
There's a thousand things that could blow that buck right outta there if you wait, leaving you with nuttin'.

http://www.huntersfriend.com/products/archery/targets/images/mckenzie-hd-bedded-buck-target-jumbo.jpg

[ncboman]

anything can happen but I'd likely shoot him when he walks under my stand or at some point before he lays down.

per the shot, at 20 yds and if I'm comfortable, I'd shoot ...probably toward the middle blue. The posture of the target is not quite realistic of a deer at ease, more of one squatted. It's an easier kill than the buck in the actual pic. The actual pic is more what I normally see and the shoulder bones and everything else are relaxed and lower than it looks. That plate isn't running up to the back now and is more horizontal and in the way.

It's a tricky situation but by watching the deer closely I think an arrow can be put in the breadbasket. Might not be a complete passthru though and the deer will likely run like a scalded cat with the arrow still in him. ... thinking property line. :rolleyes:

of course he could be spined easy enough ...

:D

[dave-t.]

The pictured puck is laying so you can see both shoulders. The front of the deer is more of a quarter to shot than it looks.

Also at the angle we are looking at, which is level with the deer, the exit would be higher on the body than the entry. The heart is practically behind grass. From a stand, the actual angle to the target area would look quite a bit different than it is in the picture.

I've only shot one deer that was bedded, I was on the ground and he was laying b-side only 180* different, he was looking back over his shoulder at me, with his back to me. I aimed as low as I dared, thinking from the angle that the spine was almost midline from looking at him. I still almost went too high, but that was with a .44, and he still only went 45-50yds.

Taking away the bottom 3" of the target from view, because of grass, makes the whole target spot and angles game look different. From up in a stand, he'd practically be b-side.


I have to take some of that back, I've shot two bedded deer. Just remembered one. ;) And heck that wasn't even very long ago.:o

[GF.]

I'm with Dave... the deer is a lot more quarter-to than the target and his spine is not on top, the way the target is built.

The other complication is that he's got both ends curled toward the shooter- that puts a lot of bone close together on the near side.

If I really 'had to' take this shot, I'd take the time to figure out as near as possible where the shoulder blade really is and I'd hold to drop the shaft in on the lower margin of the blade so that if I did hit it, it would be in a relatively soft, thin piece of bone...

So a little forward and a little low of center green... The off-side shoulder is forward, out of the way, so the exit should be a good bleed, even though the entry would probably be through heavy muscle, which can seal things off a little too effectively for my tastes.

And NC is right that this could be a good opportunity for a spine shot, but I don't think anybody would recommend that to anybody who needed a recommendation, if you know what I mean.

[ncboman]

That tuff of hair just above the grass is probably in line with his heart.

[My buddy]

I really don't care for the bedded shot. I find it very difficult to determine exactly how the buck is contorted and the relationship of the vitals.

I will say one thing....I would'nt base my shot selection off of the scoring rings of 3-d targets. I have seen plenty of 3-d targets that did'nt appear to have the scoring rings in proper alignment to vitals. I guess often times it has more to do with shot angle than the actual rings, but then again I have seen some poor ring locations.

If I were to take a shot on this bedded buck ( which I would'nt...I would take my chances that he would present a shot we he stood up) I would shoot to the right of the middle green dot. Everything else seems too far back and the yellow dot almost seems like trolling.....lol

Also the deer in the picture is "quartered to" more so than the 3d target. My mindset would be a whole lot different is the buck was bedded slightly quartering away, in which there would be a much larger window to slip an arrow into the vital area, without fear of hitting the shoulder.

[ncboman]

I will say one thing....I would'nt base my shot selection off of the scoring rings of 3-d targets. I have seen plenty of 3-d targets that did'nt appear to have the scoring rings in proper alignment to vitals. I guess often times it has more to do with shot angle than the actual rings, but then again I have seen some poor ring locations.


Couldn't agree more.

3D shoots, great idea, poorly used.

Most 3D shoots set some of the targets at angles that make shooting the scoring rings almost the worst shot choice in a real hunting situation. I can have a lot of fun shooting a 3d course just to 'kill the animals'. Shooting a competition for high score isn't nearly as much fun.

[My buddy]

Couldn't agree more.

3D shoots, great idea, poorly used.

Most 3D shoots set some of the targets at angles that make shooting the scoring rings almost the worst shot choice in a real hunting situation. I can have a lot of fun shooting a 3d course just to 'kill the animals'. Shooting a competition for high score isn't nearly as much fun.


I hate when I walk up to a 3d target and it has any kind of forward angle. Sometimes I will wait so long that someone will ask me what is wrong. I just shush them and tell them that I am waiting for the animal to turn.....lol

I can't agree with you more ncboman, shooting "killing shots" is way more fun.
In fact when I first started shooting 3d tourneys I did'nt know exactly where the scoring rings were located on all on the various targets, so I would just shoot were I thought the best "killing shot" was. It cost me several points and several wins until I learned exactly where they are were.

[ncboman]

I don't think anyone knows the real deal on 3D targets when they begin.

I doan shoot the shoots any more. My boys didn't take to it and I didn't care for the company of a few of the top shooters, not to mention the major time/expense of chasing the circuit.

I am into precision shooting though and enjoy shooting with good archers. :)

[GF.]

I never paid any attention to the scoring rings in the first place..... They're only 'anatomically correct' for textbook shots the likes of which I rarely see with any weapon at any range.

I just have 3 choices for the score on any shot - dead, missed, or something not suitable for a family-oriented site like this....

So basically, I look at the path that the arrow would have taken through the animal had it exited, and decide if I would have gotten both lungs or if I really wouldn't want to have to follow that trail. When I was tradshooting a couple or three times a week, my 'surely dead' percentage would run in the high 80s to mid 90s when shooting at distances that are pretty well covered by my #2 pin without need for deliberately holding over or under--that's farther than I would be likely to shoot when hunting barebow, but pretty well slam-dunks now....

And I recall very clearly that that bedded buck target was a really tough one to kill clean!