How do you spot 'em?

[GF.]

The big ones, that is...

Over on the QDM page, I floated the idea of slot limits for the antler restriction regs. That way, guys who wanted to shoot something could hammer away at the spikes and does, and then the more promising 1.5s and the majority of the 2.5s would get a pass for a few years.

Trouble is, what kind of antler restrictions could be written to make that happen? :confused:

I'm not at all hopeful that regs like this could ever get put in place, of course,but as guidelines for those of us who'd like to do it voluntarily, what's a good rule of thumb for knowing a 3.5 when you see one?

[dave-t.]

When his neck is about as deep as his chest, his shoulders are big and defined, and his rack is starting to get some 'wow' factor. For around here, a buck going 180lb+ dressed weight and rack 120"+ is a 3 yr old. Body language changes too.

[GF.]

Funny thing is....

That dude I got last fall is one of the biggest deer I've ever shot - and would score pretty well if symmetrical on the 4-point side - but he really didn't get my attention until after I'd shot him....:rolleyes:

I suppose I ought to measure the 4-point side, use the actual spread, and see what happens, but the 'wow' factor wasn't really there 'til I had the antlers in my hands. I guess because it's a somewhat small rack compared to his body size....

[dave-t.]

GF- Here is a pic of a grand old buck (that I flat out stole from another site:o ). This guy could be 5.5-6.5+yrs old. Thick neck, old face, side set antlers, wide heavy shoulders, deep chest, saggy brisket in front of his shoulders. He's got it all body wise, and he's far from being pumped up by rut hormones which maximizes some of those signs.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j235/silver_yummies/appletrees12-2.jpg

Look at his rack, short tine length, not good on mass, great width, but honestly not much over 21" or so mainbeams. This buck may go +or- 125"net p&y, very close either way. The guy who posted it says it was from WI, which is no slouch in producing mega bucks.

The deal is, not every deer is going to score well or have xxx" of antler, no matter his age.

The opposite is also true. I shot a 10pt, 2.5yr old last year in gun season, that had potential to be a brute.:( Caught some flack over it from the buddies too.

Do a google image search, and look at bodies more than antlers. Also, know what the deer and body sizes are in your local area, so you can come up with a best guess. Best guess is all anyone really has to work with, until they start pulling jaw bones or have picture evidence over several years of the same deer.

[Altjaeger]

The big ones, that is...

Over on the QDM page, I floated the idea of slot limits for the antler restriction regs. That way, guys who wanted to shoot something could hammer away at the spikes and does, and then the more promising 1.5s and the majority of the 2.5s would get a pass for a few years.

Trouble is, what kind of antler restrictions could be written to make that happen? :confused:

I'm not at all hopeful that regs like this could ever get put in place, of course,but as guidelines for those of us who'd like to do it voluntarily, what's a good rule of thumb for knowing a 3.5 when you see one?


You just described the Texas Antler restrictions. You may shoot 2 bucks in most counties under these rules in which one antler is unbranched. In otherwords spikes or 3 points.

Alternatively you can shoot one spike and a buck more than 13" in spread.

[GF.]

Better be careful there, Alt... next thing you know I'll be agreeing with you, and we Coloradans don't much care to do that with Texans.... ;)

Maybe I'm nuts, but that makes damn good sense to me.

And Dave - I think I got the picture on the slam-dunks :D I don't think anybody in his right mind would ever look at that old dog and figure he just needed a few more years to grow...

[GF.]

I'm not talking about deer like this 'management buck.... (packages from $1500 to $3500.... :rolleyes:)

http://vswhitetailranch.com/yahoo_site_admin/assets/images/DSC_0050.140200945_std.jpg

I'm thinking about tougher calls such as....


http://k43.pbase.com/u8/rcm1840/upload/37477895.WhiteTailBuck.jpg

http://www.swinarskiphotography.com/images/buck-by--corn-3.jpg

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_IUvr-4o_5w8/SMvQwR-YNYI/AAAAAAAAAxI/4SUD6e_cQ44/s400/4-buck+velvet+gone.jpg

That sort o' thing... Is it a great 1.5, and average 2.5 or a substandard 3.5?

Actually, this one's my favorite:

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/105/284188848_f5cfb54ed2.jpg

When that's all you have to work with, the ARs could be a lot less welcome than they are from where I'm sitting today :D

[dave-t.]

That management buck:rolleyes:.

http://www.swinarskiphotography.com/images/buck-by--corn-3.jpg
1.5yrs, count on it. Also, the type of deer antler restrictions don't protect.:(

The bottom two pics not older than 2.5. Skinny necks, chest not deeper than elbow, long legs, bigger on the back end of the deer. Doe bodied.

The very bottom may be a 2.5, hard to tell behind the tree.

The neck is generally the giveaway between old and young. In the rut, even that can be muddy though.

In general, when the front end is smaller than the back end, its young. When the front end out weighs the back end, you've got a keeper....in general.

[Herne]

I don't think there is a problem at all - no one is going to shoot at a deer without having had a darned good check behind him that it is safe. So you have a decent pair of binos on you - and you check the deer out.

The problem with the legal approach is that some will make genuine mistakes, and some will make "genuine" mistakes. And ARS will protect the undersized and mangy. And we all know, one of the cardinal sins of deer management is to judge a buck by his antlers alone.

The solution is dead simple, if unpalatable. Fairly self policing too. You want to shoot a big one, you buy a ticket for a big one. Then at check in, if you see someone with a suspect carcass, (that doesn't match the ticket) the hunter has an interest in the law being maintained. But, you buy your ticket before you shoot him, not after.

And you impose swingeing fines for those who don't comply. And people will have to learn, as a condition of going hunting, how to sort the wheat from the chaff.

[Altjaeger]

That systems works. You and I have both seen it work. However, it would not be politically feasible here, at least in the near future. I predicted about 30 years ago when I first hunted Germany and saw many of the non-hunting land use and social customs that they would come to American when the population density reached higher levels but it might take a century or so in arriving.