Went deer hunting

[Smitty5]

I had some pre season work to do on the lease which inluded rebuilding and moving a feeder, taking down a very heavy custom feeder and doing some bowhunting. I didn't get serious abut bowhunting till the last evening as I was there three days. I did get on a stand or two each morning. I saw a nice 8 point, a 7 point and a 6 point, two button bucks and several fawns. I was after a fat doe of which I was able to get a shot at two. The first was in line with the sun as it was going down and I couldn't see my pin well enough to shoot. The second doe was a fully mature deer which came up from behind me and stopped broadside facing away at 15 yards. Here is the rub, my bow is sighted in at 25 yards and I am shooting downward from 15 feet up. I put the pin in the center of the deers chest a few inches behind her shoulder and let fly, the arrow just barely clears her back. My bow is a pretty flat shooter using 2115 shafts and 100 gr. Magnus 2 blade heads. On the level I doubt the arrow would have been more than 3 inches up at 15 yards. It looked like the arrow went 10 inches above my line of sight. Is this about right? I will definitly bring a target and set a pin for shooting at a downward angle next time I'm there but is ther a formulae for figuring angle versus arrow path?

[GF.]

You really wanna sweat some kind of formula when there’s a deer under your stand? :eek

Practice is the most important thing. Yes, you’ve gotta hold lower, but you’ve also gotta maintain the same form that will put the arrow where it’s supposed to go, plus or minus the change in POI due to the angle.

And JMO, your form is a lot more important than the physics of projectiles in motion. Being in a treestand will put you a little bit higher, but not likely a half a foot.

The other possibility is to change your pin settings for hunting season. Instead of a 25-yard zero for your #1 pin, why not 15, 20, 30 or 15, 25, 35? You still have to maintain good shooting form, but that #1 pin should keep it on a real tight string from 10 yards to about 20, so if it’s not a gimme, use the #2 and if you think it’s long for the #2, then let it come in a little closer or just let it go. ‘Cuz if you think it’s a stretch for that #2 pin, you really ought to have some form of measurement instead of just a guesstimate.

JMO, freaky-fast bows are like freaky-fast cartridges: they’re only a little bit more useful than standard set-ups, and even then their ‘benefits’ show up only at the ranges where you really need a rangefinder anyway…:rolleyes:

Look at the bright side – at least you missed clean. Just work on your form and hold a few inches up from the bottom of the brisket on the close ones.

[Smitty5]

Well add 6 inches to the already there 3 inches and you get pretty close to 10 inches. I think I will just use a ground blind next weekend and set up a bit farther out.

[GF.]

You've had me thinkin' about this whole deal....

I think I'm going to lower my sights, as it were, and see what happens at 15/25/35 for the first three.

15 would be the treestand and 'right there in tradbow range' pin, and it ought to keep the arrow on such a tight string that I won't have to worry about holding over or under at the steeper angles.

25 would be just a hair longer than my #1 already is, so it'd be the right choice for anything that was from a tree at a not-too-steep angle, and anything from the ground that's not clearly right there close...

And 35 would probably be just for practice ;) In the uber-funnel, the whole thing's only about 50 yards across, with my tree smack in the middle, so I'd virtually never even have a chance to use it there, and I don't think I'd need it to set up on the other great funnel area either. If I did, I guess I could step things off...

Which leaves me with 2 more pins still unassigned, but I'm thinking that I can rejoin my old club with the 3D course for about what it would cost to have a cheap 3D buck shipped to the house, and at the club I can shoot from elevated positions - and much longer range, of course - and without worrying about so many people around as there in the yard, where you just never really know.

So at that rate, probably 45 and 55 would do nicely, unless I wanted that last pin to be just stupid-long to see how well I can group at extreme archery ranges as a check on my form....

Anybody see a pitfall on the 15/25/35? Too much drop between #2 and #3 for a guy without a rangefinder, maybe? Again, I wouldn't expect to use that #3, but then there's what actually happens when you're hunting... Even with things stepped off pretty well, it's easy to be off by a couple of steps when they're not lined up with a mark....

[Twanger]

My top pin is zeroed for 20 yards and I'm shooting about 270 fps.

Hunting from a tree stand at 20 feet and shooting at a deer at 10 yards I generally need to aim about 3 inches below where I want the arrow to strike. If I take my time and really bend at the waist to square-up my form relative to the steep angle then I only need to aim about 1.5 inches low. It's easy for me to forget to bend at the waist! At that steep an angle you need to hit a little high anyway so you can catch the off-side lung. Bottom line is that I aim just a little below center-line and expect the arrow to hit a little above center-line and exit below center-line on the other side.

I don't think arrow trajectory alone caused you to miss by 10 inches... probably a combination of things. Some arrow flight, maybe your bow-arm recoiled up because you didn't bend at the waist, and maybe you missed high a little too... all adding up to a hair-shaving miss.

Been there, got the T-shirt.

There's nothing like shooting at a 3D deer from your stand to get this sorted out quickly.

GF Said: what about 15/25/35?

If your bow is relatively fast (over 240 fps) then there's no real need. If it's under 220 fps then those would probably be good ranges to set your pins to.

[Bushman]

I think that a lot depends on your bow and which arrows that you use too. Back in the day, I went from wooden arrows to those fiberglass arrows and they were heavy. My sight pin arrangement looked more like a garden rake. Aluminum arrows helped that some and carbon arrows would have been even flatter. Even with those heavy arrows, point blank range was anything out to around 20 yards. Remember too that deer crouch to run and my bows were never fast enough to beat the string jump on a farther shot. Shooting over a deer is sometimes blamed on a bad range estimation when in reality the deer ducked. The video Bow Hunting October Whitetails showed what happens really well.

Twanger's line about squaring up to shoot sure has lots of Merritt too. There was a heavy antlered 10 pointer with his brisket shaved because he showed up behind where I wanted him to go. A cross footed behind you shot does not a full length draw make.

[Smitty5]

After visualizing the shot I think she was looking at me when I shot. I was sitting and had to stand and must have made some noise. She could easily have crouched down a bit as I was intent on the arrow. I also shot some field points at a target yesterday from the roof of my house and at 15 yards the bow hits about 7 inches high, up some from shooting on the level. I don't need another pin, I think I'll take it as a lesson learned and hold a bit lower next time.

[GF.]

If your bow is relatively fast (over 240 fps)....

Yup, sure is :D


Or at least it damn well better be! :eek:

But my #1 is set closer to 25, and that's probably fine for Elk, but a little 'coarse' for deer. I'm starting to think that a lot more deer get shot close to the spine - and then run off - than I ever would have thought possible. Starting to get the idea that that's where a lot of those myths about an "under the spine 'gap' " get started.....

[Twanger]

But my #1 is set closer to 25, and that's probably fine for Elk, but a little 'coarse' for deer.

We laugh about how hard a shot it is to shoot these little 50-60lb fawns because the KZ is so small. :D An 800lb elk probably has a KZ that's 10 times the area of one of these little deer... maybe more.

[GF.]

That would depend on whether you're going by dimensional or volumetric measure ;)

But yeah - I'm sure you could pack most fawns into the ribcage of a cow Elk with plenty of room to spare. On the other hand, you might not be able to fit an Elk's heart into the ribcage of a skipper :eek:

Kinda interesting to visualize an oval-shaped target as you rotate the angle... The KZ on a deer might be 12" 'tall' from a ground-level perspective and shrink to half o' that when looking straight down onto it. And at that rate, 3" high is a bit problematic.....