"Hunt the deer and not the spot"

[Bushman]

NCB's advice back in the "can a woods be too thick" tread has been eating on me for a couple of weeks now. Sure I had found a thick area in the national forest that the deer might get to, but they first needed to run the gauntlet from all the other guys hunting the higher ground. That is providing that there were some deer there in the first place. Zero fresh sign, no rubs and only a couple of half hearted scrapes over miles of high ground just did not have me brimming over with anticipation for our opener in two weeks.

I know a great spot back in the state land, but it was always too far to walk into every morning. Then remembering back some years when I pulled out a beautiful 8 point because I did something that other guys were not willing to do... Wilderness camp. Flash forward to last week scouting that section. Bare ground trampled deer trails, dozens of fresh scrapes, 4.5" long splayed out deer tracks with the dew claws indented, rubs the size of my upper arm, lots of deer sightings... Can you tell that I'm a little pumped? I've got the time, the tent, the sleeping bag, the camping equipment, the deer sled or cart, the rope winch and now the location. I need a special permit to wilderness camp on state land, but that is on the way now too. What a difference a location makes. Thanks NCB for kick starting my brain a couple weeks back.

[Herne]

agreed - hunting hte land is a terible terrible mistake.

i'm glad NCB broughti t up - again because it bears repeating, and its something i've been rabbiting about in our last existence.

I think, reading the posts, that many people are guilty of hunting what appears to be a great spot without engaging brain any further.

Or they hunt a place that was great midsummer, without reference to changes in cropping patterns, food or cover.

[postoak]

What do the dew-claws mean? A heavy deer?

[Alan R McDaniel Jr]

As they get older their joints start breaking down and their feet splay out and the dew claws make a print. I feel like I use my dew claws for traction these days.

Alan

[postoak]

Interesting. One of the scrapes on one of the trails I blazed had a moderate-large hoof print in it and the dew clews were more distinct than any others I've ever seen. It may have just been due to the loose soil, tho.

Anyway, Bushman, I'm glad you're going to camp out and go way back in for a big one.

[ADK Jakes]

I can't wait to hear the outcome! Go get him!

[Bushman]

Postoak, yes, I start paying a lot of attention to tracks that splay out and indent the dew claws in shallow soil. As the sand, mud or snow gets deeper, lots of the smaller deer tracks will also show dew claw indentations. The ligaments that hold the cloven hooves together get weaker as a deer ages and gets heavier. They tend to walk more back on their heels, so the dew claws show more often. That section has some really big hills and the deer really pump their shoulder muscle areas up so the buck's hooves splay by age 3 or 4. What can fool you though is when the deer track is a running track because they are coming down harder on their hooves and the tracks, buck or doe, tend to splay. It is just not tracks either because you need to put it together with the size of the rubs in the area too.

I do wonder about the size of the scrapes though. Lots of rubs and scrapes in an area say to me that there are more bucks in the area and that the competition for the does is greater. I probably pay more attention to rubs than I do scrapes because the scrapes go where the does are and the rubs go where the buck spends more time. Starting the 21 of November, we are hunting mostly post rut bucks and they don't move that much on their own. What do you guys think about the size of scrapes? Most of them are wash tub size, but two of them were half the size of a truck hood. Does that mean that just a lot of bucks are using them or does it say something about the size of the buck making them?

[dave-t.]

It means a lot of deer work that scrape.

If you've ever seen a deer work a scrape, they don't always hit the bare dirt with their urine, so when the next one comes along, they scratch out that scent to add their own, and the scrape gets bigger.

At my old house there was a scrape under a pecan tree that was 4' circle most years, and about every deer that walked by checked it out. They didn't all work it, but an aweful lot of them did. Age and sex didn't seem to matter on which deer would leave their mark in it. The bigger bucks did seem to work it almost every time they passed by though.

[Twanger]

I beg to differ about "hunting the deer, not the spot."

I know several spots on public land where I can walk in, set my stand up, and have a good chance of killing a deer without scouting it in advance.

Can you kill a big buck that way? Yes. I've done it twice.

[dave-t.]

I know of a few places like that Twanger. One location I would say you could park a truck in a wide open cornfield, and shoot deer in said field any time of the day at less than 100yds, until you're done shooting deer.

There are super funnels out there.

Ever heard of one stand location that put down 5 bucks in a day? I know of two spots that it happened. No drives, no dogs, just deer using the land and it's natural corridors.

[Herne]

Dewclaws. Or softer ground, or the deer was running. Check the stride.

Agreed - there are places where you do find a very good chance. But thats the exception that proves the rule.

I don't think you have to actually "see" a deer under ones stand. The point is to look at the land and try to work out where the deer will be today, as opposed to where they were yesterday. Wind shelter warmth cover etc.

For instance its pretty pointless, despite having seen a shedload of deer at a place yesterday, going there again today if the wind has changed, and what was warm and sheltered is now hit by a biting easter form Siberia. That's what I mean about hunting the deer. I'm quite prepared to hunt anywhere blind, (on previous knowledge) if it fits where the deer are likely to be.

[GF.]

Or semi-natural, in my case :D

My superfunnel is bordered on one side by a deer-proof fence, but no matter- it’s one you could pick out from an airplane or a topo map. Yes, the area’s lousy with deer sign, but if that were to come as a surprise to any of us here, well…. I guess I’d be surprised :D

Looks like I’ve got a new spot to hunt, though I won’t be able to get on it to hunt ‘til the 18th or so. Once I know where it is, I’m expecting to be able to use aerial photos, Google Earth, Bing “bird’s eye views” and so on to sort things right out and save a lot of time on the ground. Hopefully, I’ll just be confirming my suspicions, but there’s nothing like a day on- stand with the binoculars to confirm or refute the assumptions that you had going in …..

[postoak]

Bushman, how far in do you have to carry your camping equipment? Do you make multiple trips? This sounds like a lot of work!

[Bushman]

Oh probably about a mile from where I can get the truck then hunting in from there, but it is that first hill and valley where you could hide Packer Stadium that keeps folks out of there. I expect one big back pack load should get me enough supplies to hang out for a few days. The nice part about having it to myself is that I can come out and resupply, go where I want to and the deer don't get pushed around by other people. The deer just do what deer do because nobody baits them back in there. I expect that it will be more work, but doing what most other guys won't do has it's rewards. I pulled a 210# dressed 154" 18 (a 10 with lots of stickers) out of there some years back as well as a 230# 10 so it has some potential. Now I've got to look at my menu to see what would be good to take in to eat.

[GF.]

Not sure I envy you the pack out, but hey, man - tear it up!

I read something o a CT-focused site... I think our state forests close at dark. How heffed is THAT???

That's what concerns me about my 'new' spot right now... I don't know if it's too far for day-tripping, and if I have to drop some big dollars on a place to stay the night, this is going to go outside the budget pretty fast....

Maybe I can find a state campground near-by, though. Assuming they're not all closed for the winter. Hmmm.... I wonder if my sister would let me crash on her couch :D She's better'n half-way there....